Discussion:
Changing init systems
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Christopher Conforti
2022-02-19 17:21:45 UTC
Permalink
My Debian install is broken to the point where the package manager mostly
refuses to do anything useful. I can't reinstall because I need it for my
work and I can't waste time collecting all my software again. I need to
fix it from within, and I want to start by migrating away from systemd to
sinit. (You can find sinit on suckless.org)

Systemd is a bloated piece of garbage, the fuel of dumpster fires the
world over. It's a damn cancer upon the software world. I really don't
know if it's the cause of my system being broken; I suspect at this point
I have no way of knowing within a reasonable timeframe, since it's not
possible for a single human to understand it in its entirety because it's
just so damn complex and does WAY more than an init system should do.
It's equally likely that I did something stupid at some point--but again,
I can't seem to be able to know at this point. It's a damn headache to
work with, and I'm choosing its replacement as the first thing I'm going
to do to fix my horribly broken install, because why not?

Sinit is, in its entirety, less than 200 lines of code--that includes the
Makefile. I understand completely what it's doing, and how it's put
together. This convinces me that it is absolutely the right choice for
replacing systemd.

I don't know how to migrate to a different init system without bricking
my install--I've never had the need to do so; but now that I do, my
searches yield no useful information. I don't know what needs to be done
for a (relatively) seamless migration, and I've never actually used an
init system anything like sinit i.e., one with init scripts instead of
unit files.

Can anyone offer advice? Where can I find information on this?
Ted
2022-05-27 20:21:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Christopher Conforti
I don't know how to migrate to a different init system without bricking
my install--I've never had the need to do so; but now that I do, my
searches yield no useful information. I don't know what needs to be done
for a (relatively) seamless migration, and I've never actually used an
init system anything like sinit i.e., one with init scripts instead of
unit files.
Can anyone offer advice? Where can I find information on this?
The best advice I can give is install a different distro that comes with
another init system out of the box. Due to systemd's do-many-things-and-
do-them-poorly nature, distros like Ubuntu and (vanilla) Debian can't
function without it. I've been using MX Linux for almost 3 years & can
attest to its ease in replacing sysvinit with other init systems with no
breakage. I've been successful in installing OpenRC (there's a guide) but
I'm sure you can replace sysvinit w/ sinit using similar steps.

There is also Devuan and antiX if you need something Debian-based and
systemd-free but don't want all the bells and whistles of MX.
Aharon Robbins
2022-05-31 06:19:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted
There is also Devuan and antiX if you need something Debian-based and
systemd-free but don't want all the bells and whistles of MX.
Is there a Ubuntu replacement that doesn't use Systemd? I like being
able to use apt to install / update stuff. In particular, I've been
using Ubuntu Mate for a number of years now...

Thanks.
--
Aharon (Arnold) Robbins arnold AT skeeve DOT com
Ted
2022-08-22 22:42:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Aharon Robbins
Post by Ted
There is also Devuan and antiX if you need something Debian-based and
systemd-free but don't want all the bells and whistles of MX.
Is there a Ubuntu replacement that doesn't use Systemd? I like being
able to use apt to install / update stuff. In particular, I've been
using Ubuntu Mate for a number of years now...
Thanks.
MX Linux makes use of apt. I think most Debian-based distros now come
with apt as the frontend. If you don't mind having to install Mate from
the repos (XFCE is the default) it's worth checking out. It's as simple
as "sudo apt install mate", log out, switch DEs and log back in.
seth Hurst
2022-08-29 09:39:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted
Post by Aharon Robbins
Post by Ted
There is also Devuan and antiX if you need something Debian-based and
systemd-free but don't want all the bells and whistles of MX.
Is there a Ubuntu replacement that doesn't use Systemd? I like being
able to use apt to install / update stuff. In particular, I've been
using Ubuntu Mate for a number of years now...
Thanks.
MX Linux makes use of apt. I think most Debian-based distros now come
with apt as the frontend. If you don't mind having to install Mate from
the repos (XFCE is the default) it's worth checking out. It's as simple
as "sudo apt install mate", log out, switch DEs and log back in.
I've got arch here with nodm xfce as the desktop. Would love to try to get
into slac but I require accessibility on the account I gots no eyeballs.
Best of luck to you.
Ted
2022-09-02 17:25:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by seth Hurst
I've got arch here with nodm xfce as the desktop. Would love to try to
get into slac but I require accessibility on the account I gots no
eyeballs. Best of luck to you.
If by slac you mean slackware, I'd be kind of surprised that they don't
have accessibility settings. I never checked when I was using it. Looking
at MX's accessibility settings right now, it's 1 checkbox and a logout/
login to enable the screen readers and magnifiers. If you want to stick w/
Arch-based distros and avoid systemd, Artix is the best way to go.
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